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The TTR250 FAQ web pages -> TTR250 -> Sprockets, chains and gearing -> Will 13 - 48 work with 106 link chain?
Post Info TOPIC: Will 13 - 48 work with 106 link chain?
yamalama


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Will 13 - 48 work with 106 link chain?
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Hello again.

My 'Blue tank' model TTR came to me with 14 - 44 gearing and a 106 link chain. I want to lower the gearing while ideally using the current chain, which is in good condition.

I read on this site that 13 - 48 fits well with the standard 108 link chain. But I also read that 14-44 was standard gearing and my bike has this with a 106 (not 108) link chain. The rear tyre is a Mitchelin T63, 120/80 - 18 and I currently have reasonable clearance betweem the front of the rear tyre and the mud flap and swing arm.

Is anyone able to tell me if I can use my 106 link chain with a 13-48 sprocket set up without getting tyre clearance problems? Would I be able to change the tyre for a higher profile Mitchelin AC10, 120/90-18?

Thanks

 

Lama



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Nomada_Firefox


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Perhaps it help you, for a 14-52, I needed 112 links with a 120/90-18, with a 110/100-18 I needed at least two more. Now you can try and if you need more links, you can add them with clips.

About the Mitchelin AC10, only one comment, it is the worse tyre never seen in mud.:)

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barra8


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Nomada_Firefox wrote:

Perhaps it help you, for a 14-52, I needed 112 links with a 120/90-18, with a 110/100-18 I needed at least two more. Now you can try and if you need more links, you can add them with clips.

About the Mitchelin AC10, only one comment, it is the worse tyre never seen in mud.:)

Not sure why you need two extra links from 112 as Yamaha uses 110L on the below with no dramas. Also they use the 110L with the 14T sprocket.

....................................................................

TIRE (100/100-18 59M D739)


SPROCKET, DRIVEN (52T)

CHAIN, DRIVE (DID520V2-110L)


SPROCKET, DRIVE (13T)

...........................................................................

Jarrah.



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barra8


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Make                                       Year                              

Yamaha250 TT R96-9850-3213550-320031444520106
Yamaha250 TT R93-9550-3213550-320031443520106
Yamaha250 TT R 4PXA,4PX9    03-0450-3213550-320031444520

122

This info above is weird but it does seem that 106 or 108 is correct for your current gearing.

I'm guessing that the bottom line of this info is a missprint as i'm pretty sure there is no difference between blue tank models & steel. Also i'm using 110L chain with 14/51 gearing on my ''BLUE'' model & it's sitting at setting 11 1/2 (at the rear of swingarm) with a 110/100 18 tire. Still room for 14/52 gearing without chainging the chain. It would be sitting at setting 1-7 (closest to the front of swingarm) with 14/52.

I know that if your wheel is at the front of the swingarm you can use two extra links ie. 106-108L (same gearing) without it going too far back & vice versa. This will explain why some poeple use 106L with 14 - 44 & some people 108L

QUESTION: Can you take a pic of where your snail adjusters sit or let us know if they are at the front or back now ie. At settings 1-7 or 7-13..... .This is why i can't say for sure whether 106 will fit.

....................

Jarrah.

 



-- Edited by barra8 on Saturday 2nd of February 2013 01:40:43 PM

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barra8


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Wrong info my bad...this sprocket stuff always gets me but i'm right for my ratio atleast wink



-- Edited by barra8 on Saturday 2nd of February 2013 01:02:40 PM

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barra8


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Oh thanks Brindabella I knew i was forgeting something with the chart lol i'll try to fix it. Or since your so good at this maybe you could upload a chart. Lol it gets confusing for me :)

I thought he might need 108L from the start but all these numbers get confusing lol (not much good at maths) smile

.............

Jarrah.



-- Edited by barra8 on Saturday 2nd of February 2013 01:37:19 PM

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Nomada_Firefox


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barra8, you did not understand or you did not know what is a 110/100 at a Scorpion Pirelli Mid Soft, the tyre will not enter very well if you have a 14-52 with 112 links. I will show you later how a 120/90 from a Dunlop 952 looks and probably you will understand better because a 110/100 from a Scorpion Pirelli Mid Soft does not enter.

I do not know if the word at english is this but the explanation is it, many tyre companies do not count the large from the taco when they calculate the side face from the tyre. By this reason many tyres add a larger side face.

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barra8


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Nomada_Firefox wrote:

barra8, you did not understand or you did not know what is a 110/100 at a Scorpion Pirelli Mid Soft, the tyre will not enter very well if you have a 14-52 with 112 links. I will show you later how a 120/90 from a Dunlop 952 looks and probably you will understand better because a 110/100 from a Scorpion Pirelli Mid Soft does not enter.

I do not know if the word at english is this but the explanation is it, many tyre companies do not count the large from the taco when they calculate the side face from the tyre. By this reason many tyres add a larger side face.

Okay.... i have not tried 14/52 gearing but 110L would fit. The only problem might be the tire but by Yamaha's info it is correct.

I can understand having to go to 112L with 14/52 which would put your snail position to 7-13...

I cannot understand having to add any more though or it would be too long for your snail adjusters.

..........................

Jarrah.



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brindabella


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yamalama, to answer your original question...

NO! 13/48 will NOT work with a standard 106 link chain (as used on 14/44), regardless of tyre.
I reckon the axle could be fully forward and the chain would still be too tight.

there is currently a systematic mistake in the chart Jarrah refers to above (maybe he will edit it soon).

anyway, here's how to calculate in your situation:

13/48 is 1 tooth down on countershaft, 4 teeth up on main sprocket (compared to 14/44).
subtract 1 from 4 gives a total difference of 3 teeth more, effectively.
the chain only "sees" half of these 3 teeth and so would have to be 3/2 = 1.5 links longer.
but chain can only be gotten in multiples of 2 links.

so 13/48 would need 108 links (which would position the axle SLIGHTLY further back compared to your 14/44).

remember, if you go up 4 teeth you need an extra 2 links, so..

14/44 = 106 links
14/48 = 108 links
14/52 = 110 links

the above list corresponds with what yamaha say and with what people are using.

but because there is a reasonable axle adjustment range available on the TTR, often 2 different chain sizes will (just) work.

regarding tyres, I assume that Nomada Firefox is saying (correctly) that some tyre manufacturers measure width (eg 100mm
or 110mm or 120mm) including the tread knobs and others measure it excluding the tyre knobs.

naively one would think that a low profile 120/80 would be slightly smaller rolling diameter than 100/100 (as aspect ratio is 80, and 80% of 120 is 96, ie 4mm less than 100mm, even though it is 20mm wider) but it really depends on the tyre manufacturer's measurement method.



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Nomada_Firefox


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If you check this image, you will see how close is the tyre to this black piece. This is a Dunlop D952 120/90-18 and a Scorpion Mid Soft 110/100-18 can not be put with 112 links, you will need two more or the tyre will be too close when it is new.

ttr250-2013_2.jpg

brindabella is right about my opinion and he is right about the links from a 14/52, 110 are probably the neccesary links for a 120/80-18. 



-- Edited by Nomada_Firefox on Sunday 3rd of February 2013 10:05:56 AM

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barra8


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Nomad Firefox....

If you check out this thread you will see that you are on the wrong track.

14/52 110L with 100/100 18 tire is what Yamaha uses so if it's good for Yamaha....It's good for me.

As i said i can understand having to go to 112L chain with 110/100 18 tire but i CANNOT understand using 114L with the 14/52 combo as this should not be possible. The thread above confirms this.

I'm not trying to have a go at you just saying.

..............................

Jarrah.

 



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YAMAHA ROCKS!!!!!!

TTR250ACTIVE''BORED'' ADDICT!

Favourite quote: To be old & wise first you must be young & dumb!

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yamalama


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Thanks for all your replies, they have been very useful.

I have been giving it some more thought myself too, including digging up my school days trigonometry (and that was a long time ago). I will try to put my calculations up later but my theoretical conclusion was that changing from 14 - 44 to 13 - 46 while keeping a 106 link chain will move the rear wheel forward by 5mm. 13 - 48 would move it 12.5 mm closer.

With my chain tension set I am about half way roung the snail adjusters and have about 20mm clearance between front of rear wheel and the mud flap at the back of swing arm. However it is a worn tyre and I think a new one will have knobs about 7mm taller, reducing clearance to 13mm. So I think if I stick with the same brand of 120/80 - 18 tyre, I should be able to use 13 - 46 and still have 8mm clearance which is just about OK, but not a 13 - 48 which would leave 0.5mm clearance, with no allowance for tyre expanding as it gets warmer, mud build up or inaccuracies in my calculations due to assumptions.

I will order 13 - 46 and report back on actual observations when they are fitted

Thanks again

Lama



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