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New chain & sprockets
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After an afternoon visit to Mr TTR I have obtained a present for my TTR.

The gearbox sprocket currently on my bike (13 teeth) has finally succombed to "hookitis" and is nearing its limit of usefulness.

IMG_8876.JPG

I didn't want it replaced with a similar sized sprocket since I'm always advocating that 13 teeth put undue stress on the chain. Therefore I've plumbed for a 14 tooth sprocket.

In order that the overall ratios are similar this means that my rear sprocket will need changing. I've chosen a 52 tooth sprocket to replace the fitted 48 tooth.

The chain guide block is a tad worn also so this is being renewd.

I'll post before and after pictures when completed (if I succede.)

Martyn



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I down loaded a *.pdf handbook and found the details in the back so I just quoted them.  wink

Also - I posted a couple of pages on the TTR250 specifications HERE on this forum which had the same details.

Obviously other countries have differing specs. and I presume a purchaser can ask for things to be changed to suit himself. aww

I wonder what one would go like with a 13 gearbox and, say, a 35 rear? 

Martyn

 



-- Edited by Cubber on Friday 27th of January 2012 11:00:22 PM

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Budleigh Salterton. Devon



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Well - it's done and ready for testing.

Here is a shot of my 13 tooth gearbox sprocket showing signs of being hooked:-

IMG_8954.JPG

I thought it was going to be a struggle getting the sprocket nut off but I found it comparatively easy.

I left the old chain in situ and applied the rear brake. Using a 30mm socket and extension bar the nut turned with little effort.

IMG_8955.JPG

Here is a comparison shot of old sprocket and new. Guess which is which. biggrin

IMG_8957.JPG

This is the new sprocket and chain as fitted. I didn't need the new tab washer because the old one had two tabs and only one had been used.

IMG_8969.JPG

I changed the rear sprocket to keep the overall gear ratio similar. Here are old and new.

Img_8960.jpg

Whilst the wheel was out I took the opportunity to replace the brake pads too, here is the old set

IMG_8961.JPG

and here is the new

IMG_8963.JPG

I also adjusted the chain guide clearance and renewed the rubbing block ....

Img_8964.jpg

These are the old pads and block that I renewed.

Img_8966.jpg

I also replaced the front brake pads too - all I have to do now is get out more and use it.

Martyn



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Nice one Martyn - all ready for anything 2012 can throw at you wink



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Good report and pictures Martyn

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It will be interesting to know how the bike feels after the changes on the gearing.Was the gearing you remove Std.

Dave

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I'm lead to believe (by the handbook) that the standard sprockets for my 2000 TTR250R are 13 gearbox and 52 rear wheel. 13:52 = 4.00

As purchased mine was 13:48 = 3.69

I have now changed to 14:52 = 3.71

So mine is now geared mid way bewtween what it should be and what it was.

I don't know what it performed like on original gearing no but I've a good knowledge of what it has been like since I got it. wink

I will undoubtedly post my findings - but I'm hoping the difference will not be too discernable.

Martyn



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Never thought of looking at the handbook Martyn but my 2003 and 2004 official UK imports came with 14/44 gearing and a non-O ring chain. There was a 13 tooth front sprocket in the "spares" box with the 2004.

The TTRs are actually faster with the lower gearing as they can rev out in top.

Brian



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Agree with Brian (Oracle).

Second hand, my Official UK Import came with 13/44 and spare origonal 14 tooth rubber damped front sprocket in spares box.

For a trip to Portugal last year (in overlanding trim) I reverted to 14/44 trim and spoilt a good holiday, bike was sluggish.

Upon return, I purchased a 14/48 together with 'O' ring chain from Brian, now I am a happy bunny, bike revs out like Brian says.

Doing the maths, 13/44 is not much different than 14/48.

 

Alec



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Dead right but what low gearing to put on it confuse

Out of interest I dug out my users manual for the older TTR (in French!) model TT250RL and it gives 14/44

Same for the later one so I guess the 14/44 gearing is common to the "Euro" TTR blankstare

I am pretty sure that the handbook you posted is for the American "trail only" version of the TTR. I had a quick look at an American fiche and it lists the front and rear sprockets as 13/52.

I don't know if the Australian TTRs are like the US models or are more road orientated with the higher gearing.

Brian

 



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Thanks Martyn, for taking the time to post.  Its always nice to see really productive posts like this.  I'll be heading in to the Man Cave to see what I have on mine.  I haven't checked since I bought it last year..

I am still trying to get to grips with the whole TTR thing, import/official/grey/euro/usa...etc.  I don't know what mine is?  Its Blue! lol. But I do need to find out.

Thanks, Paul



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The handbook I downloaded could well be an American version because it mentions things like spark arresters and gasoline.

This is the front of the book
Front.jpg

 

and here is the specification page 8-2 saying 13:52 sprocket set up.
Page%25208-2.jpg

Whatever, I'll report back on my 14:52 set up in any case.

Martyn



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California obviously insisted on some extra mods to their TTRs and you will sometimes see a model number with a C added which denotes its the Californian model - as per your handbook cover TTR250R(C).

Brian



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Mystery publication solved, thanks Brian.

That also answers my niggle as to why none of the illustrations or descriptions mentioned a kick starter.

Anyroadup - I am sticking with the gearing I've chosen and am sure that any difference from the previous set up will go un-noticed, what with all the power and revs I have at my command. confusebiggrinno

Martyn



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Success - I've just returned from a testing and apart from the need now to lower the chain guide block more (chain catches it still) it performs just as before. aww

I tried a few of the steep lanes near where I live and the bike is just as tractable as before. Out of Otterton and uphill is still all second gear, as is Cop Hill Lane and its nadgery top bends, all in second (chug-chug).

The bike now needs de-sludging because the lanes are a little damp still.

The wheel is as far back as it can go because I wanted to preserve the rubber flap a bit more.
IMG_8980.JPG

If needs be I can remove another complete link, but the tyre would then catch the flap. For the record the chain is currently 114 links.

Martyn



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ok well i have an Australian 2011 model. it came with the rubber dampened 14 tooth front, which i replaced with a 13 tooth and immediately noticed the difference down low, but funny enough the bike still reached the same top speed of just over 130km/h but as i dont have a tacho, im unsure of the revs.

For the rear, the bike came with a 44 tooth which my dealer is going to change to a 46 this coming week. im unsure of what this will do.

What i am hoping to be able to achieve is a bike that can wheelie with throttle in first, so that if there is an obstacle in my way out bush i can lift the front wheel.

Will this be possible to achieve with sprocket change? i hope the change to achieve this is not so dramatic that i will lose a significant amount of top speed, as i would like to be able to do 100km/h in between trails.

interested in finding out if anyone has tried the 13 front 46 rear before?

interested in finding out what gearing i will need to achieve my goal also.

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dfaz wrote:

There is so much conflicting information on gearing jetting modifications its dificult to know what to do at times.Brian how do you find the 13 tooth is it in your opinion stressfull on chains and bearing in mind the bike will be used mostly offroad,or is it better in your opinion to keep the front 14 and change the rear .although Martyn has sucessfully fitted the 14/52 im unsure how many problems he needs to overcome with catching and wear on the chain guard I suppose we will have to watch this space Martyn.


Fettling dirt bikes is a bit like gardening.

Ask gardeners the best way to grow a certain plant and each will give you their own personal method and a lot of the information will be conflicting BUT they all grow the plants perfectly well wink

If you are unsure about what modifications to make to your TTR then my advice is to stick as close to standard as you can and, if you do make changes, do them one at a time so you can evaluate the change before making another.

Regarding gearing, I can only talk from my own experience of trail riding in Devon and Cornwall plus the occasional foray into Wales and Southern Ireland.

Although my preference is for 14/52 gearing, I am running 13/48 on my TTR at the moment and it is perfectly fine.

I don't know what sort of riding you have in your area but, if it isn't too technical then 14/48 might be perfectly adequate.

The reason I run reduced gearing is so that, in the lanes, I don't have to use 1st gear except for the very gnarliest sections. The rider has less control of the bike in 1st gear as it is so responsive to throttle movements, either voluntary or involuntary no

It is much easier to ride in the higher gears, especially in the ruts - just fan the clutch when needed.

Logic says that the bigger the front sprocket the kinder it will be to the chain but, that said, I know many American TTR250 owners put 12 tooth front sprockets on as they have dedicated dirt trails and their TTRs don't necessarily ever see tarmac.

I found that putting the long chain guard back on my TTR at least doubled chain life so this has much more effect on chain life than 13 v 14 tooth front sprocket.

Happy to answer any questions as best I can but remember I am not really giving you answers, just my opinion wink

PS If you really want to start a debate amongst dirt bikers, go onto a 4-stroke dirtbike forum and ask for a recommendation as to what engine oil to use ashamed



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davecambo wrote:

ok well i have an Australian 2011 model. it came with the rubber dampened 14 tooth front, which i replaced with a 13 tooth and immediately noticed the difference down low, but funny enough the bike still reached the same top speed of just over 130km/h but as i dont have a tacho, im unsure of the revs.

For the rear, the bike came with a 44 tooth which my dealer is going to change to a 46 this coming week. im unsure of what this will do.

What i am hoping to be able to achieve is a bike that can wheelie with throttle in first, so that if there is an obstacle in my way out bush i can lift the front wheel.

Will this be possible to achieve with sprocket change? i hope the change to achieve this is not so dramatic that i will lose a significant amount of top speed, as i would like to be able to do 100km/h in between trails.

interested in finding out if anyone has tried the 13 front 46 rear before?

interested in finding out what gearing i will need to achieve my goal also.


 I'd also be interested to see what a 13/46 would be like.  I currently run a 14/48.  We have loads of steep rocky trails with steps/boulders in the peaks and getting some front wheel lift would be useful smile



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there is no 46 i have been told by my dealer, so he ordered 47. so it will be a 13:47


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davecambo wrote:

there is no 46 i have been told by my dealer


 Oh yes there is wink



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There is so much conflicting information on gearing jetting modifications its dificult to know what to do at times.Brian how do you find the 13 tooth is it in your opinion stressfull on chains and bearing in mind the bike will be used mostly offroad,or is it better in your opinion to keep the front 14 and change the rear .although Martyn has sucessfully fitted the 14/52 im unsure how many problems he needs to overcome with catching and wear on the chain guard I suppose we will have to watch this space Martyn.

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PS If you really want to start a debate amongst dirt bikers, go onto a 4-stroke dirtbike forum and ask for a recommendation as to what engine oil to use ....Been there done that LOL ended up using 10/40 semi sinthetic recomended by the local honda garage.

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TTR fan what top speed do you get out of the bike with a 13 48 set up? and can you get away with using the standard chain that came with my bike when it had 14 44 from the factory.

Reason i ask, is that i now have 13 tooth front, and have ordered a 47 rear from my local dealer, as he said this set up would be able to get away with using the same chain length.

I'd be interested in knowing your top speed with 13 48, and if it isnt heaps lower than what ive got now, id probably ask the dealer to forget the 47 and order me a 48 rear.

ESPECIALLY if i could get away without buying a new larger chain.

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davecambo wrote:

TTR fan what top speed do you get out of the bike with a 13 48 set up? 


 Not held it wide open in top yet. I got a 325 big bore kit on it and it sees 70mph easily wink



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how bout the chain question lol

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davecambo wrote:

how bout the chain question lol


That's coz I don't know the answer!

A lot of depends on where the wheel is in the swing arm.

As you have ordered a 47 rear, I would fit it and see how you go. One tooth isn't going to make a lot of difference IMHO.

Brian



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how do you adjust or lower the chain guide block? is this a standard function or do you have to modify it.

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oh and cubber, any benefit from changing to 14:52 or much of a muchness apart from your hypothesis about wear.

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I adjusted my chain guide block carrier with a small round file to slot the two fixing holes.
Only a small amount is required.
I also renewed the orange bakelite wear block in the guide. The chain still catches the block occasionally, mainly under acceleration when the lower run is slackest. As time progresses it will wear a groove and lessen the contact.  confuse

I have, in all honesty, not noticed any difference in the ride performance since changing ratios. She still pulls as well as before uphill in high gears and there is just as much oomph and slogability. Top speed is just the same too. smileaww

Chain and sprocket wear will be watched and I imagine I will get less wear on the gearbox sprocket with the tooth addition. The old 13 tooth sprocket lasted at least 3,000 miles before it got slightly hooked and I changed it. aww

Time (and use) will tell. smile

Martyn



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no worries. i fitted the 47 rear today, and am yet to take it on the highway to see top speed. i had a look and 13:48 is almost exactly the same as 14:52, so i might just change the 47 rear to a 48 and be done with it. You have confirmed it feels the same also.

might have to get another few links added to my chain though. my friendly yamaha dealer has one laying around he said he'd give me. i can take a couple off of that, because the adjustment snail thingys are sitting on 1 at the moment (closest) with the original chain. no room to go back any more in the chain.

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added one link to the chain today it made a world of difference. have heaps more to play with now and might be able to fit a 48 rear on no probs if i take the bike out on highway and still have too much top end with the 47

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Can I just jump on here and ask for a definitive opinion, Im getting a bit confused reading all the opinions and stuff and I think maybe easier if I say what I want to achieve?

Im currently on 13 / 44 and its not working for me. Ive got no umphhh to get up muddy slippery hills and run out of puff and keep dropping the bugger!

I want to get a set up for purely off road work, the TTR will be trailered to the green lane areas and not really ridden on tarmac much at all. Its purely for green laning and a bit lark in my mates woods (read bmx track)

Got my tyres sorted which was a massive step on the way but clearly the gearing nots ideal for what Im doing. So guys, Im a total newbie to the TTR and in my virgin stages of off roading so need a good set up to suit. I need good low speed control and umph for going uphill. Over to you guys....



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Your choices are between 13 and 14 teeth for the engine sprocket
and
between 44 to 52 for the rear sprocket. confuseconfuse

Divide the gearbox teeth by the rear teeth and you get the ratio between the two. The higher the ratio the lower top speed - but greater the sloggability.

I think most riders would prefer to use 14 for the engine in order to extend the life of the sprocket AND the chain, but these riders would tend to use their TTR on the road AND lanes.

Since you prefer to use yours purely OFF tarmac you would be OK in choosing 13 teeth on the engine.

For ultimate sloggability your choice for rear sprocket would be 52 teeth giving a final ratio of 1:4
a rear sprocket with 50 teeth gives 1:3.8
a rear sprocket with 48 teeth gives 1:3.7
a rear sprocket with 46 teeth gives 1:3.5
a rear sprocket with 44 teeth gives 1:3.4

Doesn't seem much difference, but for what you require my suggestion would be 13 gearbox and 52 rear sprocket.

You can source the bits you need from this CLICKY THINGY but there are others.

Whatever you choose you must keep us all informed. wink

Martyn



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Nice write up Martyn,very good...

I am tossing up whether to use 13/50 or 13/52??confuse 

I have heard that using a 14 tooth front sprocket wears on the front chain gaurd so not sure about using a 14 t front.

I agree with Brian that using a sprocket gear ratio ei. 13/50 or 14/52 increases your power both low and high as i have seen first hand how fast they can go with this set up compared to standard. ''Gotta love that feeling of the chain about to snap when given full throttle all of a sudden'''biggrin

Still pondering on 13/50 or 13/52 but i think i'm going the 13/52 ratio.

 



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TDVT wrote:

My bike has the 13/52, possibly stock US config, & I'm changing up to the 14/52 when I get a new chain. Already have the 14T sitting here in the office which I got from Brian, as that size isn't readily available here.

As for the the 13/52 gearing, I DO run out of steam on the top end & don't know how many times I've gone for another gear on the road, only to find I'm already in 6th . Had to add a speedo for registration & while I haven't tried to find top speed, I have managed 65mph, but it's winding out at that point. Generally, I'm only on tarmac linking up off-road sections & would like a little headroom.

Even with the 13/52, I wish the front end was a little lighter than it is, though that could be due to the rider (likely).


 Good point

That is the reason why i'm tossing up between 13/50 or 13/52 confuse

Want to go 14/52 but a little bit of modifying of the chain block and front gaurd may be needed first so i don't end up with r***ted chain gaurds/chain block no

After what TDVT just wrote i think i might go 13/50 so as to not lose too much top end speed but still have the bottom end power i need for trail riding

Also thinking about getting lighter wheels as the standard OEM rims seem to be too heavy to maintain a good wheelie

If anyone knows where to get titanium rims or strong lighter rims eg. Talon,Excel ect..please let me know



-- Edited by barra8 on Thursday 9th of August 2012 05:05:28 PM

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Martyn thats great advice many thanks.

I think 13/52 is on the cards in that case, only tarmac would be sections between lanes to be honest so the lions share of riding on a day out will be lanes. My rear tyre isnt very nice on tarmac biggrin

Looking at the link you sent I think £100 isnt unreasonable and then I have a blank sheet of new drivetrain to start from. Come next payday I will be ordering a set and will update the thread of the effects.



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I'm running the 14/52 ratio, if I was going to have a purly Dirt machine I would run the 13/52 without doubt, it would give you the ability to lift the front end easly, as it is now I use the rebound or a convenient rock etc to help wheelie

IMO the main thing keeping the front end on the ground is the weight over the forks, A light weight headlight and speedo would help heaps, you can feel the weight of these things when you swing the bars from side to side.

The problem with this ratio is it's suddenly like losing 6th gear, only makes highway travel comfortable to 80-90kph I think

I removed the chain guide completly, so far it hasn't been a problem, I may build a custom guide/guard soon out of aluminium sheet, shouldn't be to hard I guess,  Ha Ha, famous last words no

Cheers



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I found a place to buy the rims eg.. http://www.buchananspokes.net/products/excel_non_dimpled_aluminum_rims.asp they don't seem to cheap though or how much lighter they are cry

Any other ideas?



-- Edited by barra8 on Thursday 9th of August 2012 05:35:57 PM

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Thanks for that info Steve,

                                       I will now be going from 13/48 to 13/52,should be a bit of a difference i'm hoping smile



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My bike has the 13/52, possibly stock US config, & I'm changing up to the 14/52 when I get a new chain. Already have the 14T sitting here in the office which I got from Brian, as that size isn't readily available here.

As for the the 13/52 gearing, I DO run out of steam on the top end & don't know how many times I've gone for another gear on the road, only to find I'm already in 6th . Had to add a speedo for registration & while I haven't tried to find top speed, I have managed 65mph, but it's winding out at that point. Generally, I'm only on tarmac linking up off-road sections & would like a little headroom.

Even with the 13/52, I wish the front end was a little lighter than it is, though that could be due to the rider (likely).



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VERMONT USA



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thanks a million for the info.
Is my "recipe" for the gearing right? cause I havent seen anybody using it.
My main concern is if the "snails" will be able to give the tension needed for when I change to my "offroad set-up"

From the 15-48 to 13-48.



-- Edited by pantheman on Tuesday 16th of October 2012 03:01:26 PM

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Hi to all , Im Pan from Greece.
I have a question, Has anyone ever fitted a 15Tooth sprocket in front?
Im using my 1993 Open Enduro as my main commuter and the gearing Im using now (13-44) is a litle short for the road. So I was thinking in returning to the standard gearing (14-44) but a litle upscaled, and that is a 15-47 (or 15-48 cause I cant seem to find a 47T).
This will leave me the choice to change to a 13T whenever I want that extra torque to enjoy an offroad weekend.

My question is ,will a 15T fit in front?

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pantheman wrote:

Hi to all , Im Pan from Greece.
I have a question, Has anyone ever fitted a 15Tooth sprocket in front?
Im using my 1993 Open Enduro as my main commuter and the gearing Im using now (13-44) is a litle short for the road. So I was thinking in returning to the standard gearing (14-44) but a litle upscaled, and that is a 15-47 (or 15-48 cause I cant seem to find a 47T).
This will leave me the choice to change to a 13T whenever I want that extra torque to enjoy an offroad weekend.

My question is ,will a 15T fit in front?


 Hi Pan

I am sure that the 15T sprockets fit coz we sell a few. We also supply 47T rear sprockets. See http://www.totallyttrs.com/TTR250_sprockets.html

Best regards

Brian



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