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Post Info TOPIC: Is your TTR smoking?


Super Guru

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Is your TTR smoking?
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There have been a number of on-forum and offline queries about smoking engines in the last few days so I thought it might be worth putting my thoughts down here for you guys either to shoot down in flames or improve upon wink

If the smoke is the only symptom and the engine isn’t rattling then there is a very good chance that it’s a relatively easy fix with just new rings and valve stem oil seals needed to stop the smoking.

You need to get the head and barrel off to see what’s happening. There is an “how to” guide on the forum here  to help with the strip down.

In terms of stripping the engine to examine the piston and bore and perhaps fit new rings and valve stem oil seals (worth doing when the head is off) requires reasonable spanner and socket sets, feeler gauges to check valve clearances and a decent scraper to get any old gasket off. Can’t think I use any special tools – except maybe a modified (shortened) screwdriver for the cam chain tensioner coz it’s a bit awkward! 

Assuming the piston and bore look OK with no finger-catching gouges in the barrel, or a break in the continuity of the carbon ring at the top of the cylinder, then new rings might solve your problem.

To explain the carbon ring comment above a little further, a worn piston can "rock" in the bore and the signs of this will be obvious as shown in the following pics:

Worn piston.jpg

Worn barrel.jpg

If your piston and barrel are worn like this then your engine is due a new piston set and rebore. This engine definitely had a rattle, particularly as the revs built up cry

(PS I am pretty sure that the wear on this particular engine was caused prematurely by the float level being very wrong and giving an over-rich mixture. A very rich mixture will "wash" the oil off the barrel and cause the wear.)

To explain the rattle, when the piston "rocks" from side to side the skirt of the piston hits the side of the cylinder bore resulting in a tell tale noise called piston slap or, as I hear it, a rattle!

You may wish to double check the wear against the tolerances listed in the workshop manual but I have always found this difficult and instead rely on examining the pattern of wear on the parts. 

As a minimum, this is what I reckon you need if the piston and barrel look OK: 

  • Top and bottom gaskets are normally all you need e.g. http://www.totallyttrs.com/#gasket_set
  • Valve stem oil seals x 4 - about £25-30
  • Piston ring set - about £30. Don't order until you have checked the piston to see if it is a Yamaha one and whether it is oversize. Buy the ring set that is correct for the piston.
  • If your engine is still original it might be worth replacing the cylinder base O ring whilst the barrel is off as they get flattened over time. About £5-8


If the barrel needs a rebore then you will need an oversize piston kit e.g. http://www.ttr250.com/TTR_extras/#Wossner_Pistons_-_full_kit

A smoky engine will only get worse and allows the engine oil to get contaminate quickly thus exacerbating wear so needs to be dealt with as soon as sensibly possible.

Hope that helps somebody wink

Brian



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Guru

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Very good Brian,

                        Might just add a simple way to know if it is your valve stems seals is....

Leave the bike sit until cold.(hard to do for some :)

Start the bike & if smoke comes out instantly then dies down after it's warm it's valve stem seals

If it continues blowing a cloud when warm it's your rings.

Nice & easy smile

............................

Also sometimes it's not the compression rings that are worn & on a quick inspection all looks good but the oil ring could still be worn from low oil,bad oil circulation,wrong spark plug gap ie overheating..ect.

 So checking oil rings is a big one aswell.

Jarrah.


 



-- Edited by barra8 on Thursday 20th of September 2012 12:42:45 AM

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While we are on the subject...

How far can you bore the cylinder until you need an over size gasket??confuse

Not sure with TTR's & aint specified in the Yamaha bible.smile

I think Mr Yamaha likes replacing barrels for no good reason :)

.....................

Jarrah.



-- Edited by barra8 on Thursday 20th of September 2012 01:14:19 AM

__________________

YAMAHA ROCKS!!!!!!

TTR250ACTIVE''BORED'' ADDICT!

Favourite quote: To be old & wise first you must be young & dumb!

My own: Your never too young to learn an old trick! :)



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Apparrently there is a 75mm gasket also so not sure why they would need that?? see here for ebay item

Must be to resleeve/resize & why i thought i better ask.

Cheers,

           Jarrah.



-- Edited by barra8 on Thursday 20th of September 2012 03:12:59 PM

__________________

YAMAHA ROCKS!!!!!!

TTR250ACTIVE''BORED'' ADDICT!

Favourite quote: To be old & wise first you must be young & dumb!

My own: Your never too young to learn an old trick! :)



Guru

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On a double check my genuine Yamaha gasket is 75mm.

Not sure why i had it in my head it was 74mm but anyways..

biggrin Jarrah.



-- Edited by barra8 on Thursday 20th of September 2012 03:40:47 PM

__________________

YAMAHA ROCKS!!!!!!

TTR250ACTIVE''BORED'' ADDICT!

Favourite quote: To be old & wise first you must be young & dumb!

My own: Your never too young to learn an old trick! :)



Super Guru

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barra8 wrote:

How far can you bore the cylinder until you need an over size gasket??confuse

 


Yamaha and Cometic head gaskets are "one size fits all" items.

I have used the standard Cometic head gasket on my "280" engine which is the max 32mm oversize with no problems wink

Brian



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http://www.ttr250.com  - The one and only dedicated TTR250 FAQ! 
 

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Super Guru

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Posts: 8565
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barra8 wrote:

Apparrently there is a 75mm gasket also so not sure why they would need that?? see here for ebay item

Must be to resleeve/resize & why i thought i better ask.


 Nope - that is the standard Cometic kit that we sell - part number C7726 smile



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